I hate the music i make.

[Beavis]

I was just wondering if you guys could help me out. Basically i am totaly stuck. I am wondering around the large space that is my life, with no purpose or direction.

I have been playing the guitar for 9 years and i have studied alevel music, diploma at Guitar institute, grade 8 guitar and now doing the degree at GI (only becuase i didn't know what else to do) I am on the second year of the degree and i feel like the life and soul of me has been removed and drained out of me.

I remember coming out of the guitar institute after an intense year of learning and having good guitarists and tutors to inspire and push me further and further, i remember playing the end of year concert at ocean in hackney, playing a harmonic with my tounge :) I had balls i wasn't afraid of what i played and i had confidance in my playing and enjoyed playing. Now i am here 2 years on and you would hae thought i could have moved on. well i haven't except now i have no confidance. I live in a house with 3 other guitarist and i feel left out., I have done years of wood shedding and have done the technique thing and sweeping (all done on the diploma) and i am just board, i see nothing in my playing that anyone would want to listen to. Its really sad, how can i go to a jam session when i hate what i am doing. I just see the guitar as a huge Major scale with all my licks and things. Melodies have no feel because i am just joining the dots. I play where the scale goes not where the music goes, if you know what i mean.

Unfortuantly if any of you guys look at my profile you will see this is the 3rd time i have come to the board for help and i am starting to wonder wheather i have any place in the guitar field. At the moment i don't feel i should be here.

Also i ahve taken a break, i messed about for 3 months over the summer and now i am back studying i have fallen back in to the same old things. I ahve brought cubase and some recording equipment to hopfully get the creative juices flowing but its not happening. I just can seem to play anything i like. Even just a riff, i compare it to something i ahve heard. I am a very logical and calculated person mentally, i can play the guitar form a mathmatical perspective. But this doesn't seem to help when playing real music.

I just need to sort a way of enjoying the guitar, i ahve tried to listen to other types of music and i just want to work out what they are doing, i have recently done a ritchie kotzen and greg howe overload, i can play a few of their licks but i want to get in their minds and fine out what they are thinking when they improvise, how they compose and write. I want to know why they do things but i can't work out the answers.

I can't practice what i preach, i talk to alot of guitarist about problems when playing and can offer some advice and encoragment, but when i am sitting on my own i feel like smacking my head on a brick wall.

I am online alot now so i will be watching this thread and adding to it my progress,

Any help welcome, please offer you advice.

sorry this is long and might sound confusing but thats what i feel like as a guitarist.

Cheers

If anyone has article (the ibreathmusic one have been a help) websites or anything that may help i would appreciate a link.

Beavis

[EricV]

Hey there...

I can understand what you´re going through definitely. The thing is, and I think you know that already, that you need to like your music, your playing, in order for other people to like it.
If you hate your own playing, how can someone else like it. I think in some way or another, it kinda rings through when you play.

So what to do. First of all, forget all the technical stuff. I don´t mean "Forget about it" as in "Change your style of playing". What I mean is, sit down and try to come up with one nice chord progression you like. Try a few ones, until you find something that is fun to play and sounds good to you. It should be fun to play this over and over.
Now, record it... only that one chord progression or riff.
Got that ? Now, before you go on... take a deep breath. Use the loop-function of the recording software so the progression will play back over and over.
Then, pick up your guitar and listen to the chords some more. Then, start to play. Don´t start with sweeps or anything. Start with one simple melody. Play something that YOU would like to listen to ! Don´t try to come up with something thats impressive or weird. No, play something that you enjoy listening to.
Then start to add embellishments... vary the melody, add to it etc. If you want to, sing a phrase, then try to play it.
Play with dynamics... play aggressively or soft...

Don´t try to write / compose / record a "project" or a "showcase". try to come up with something simple and add to that. You should enjoy listening to it, and playing over it at all times.
The technique... well, you can add that once it feels appropiate.
try toHAVE FUN. Don´t care whether the other guys consider your tune too simple or anything. Try to make it sound good.

That´s one thing to try.

The other is: try to listen to different music. It can be a distracting thing to listen to guitar-music only. If you listen to Satriani all day long, you might limit your imagination, or might feel as if your competing with him every time you pick up the guitar... you shouldnt.
try to listen to good singers for a change. Music you usually wouldnt listen to. Try to emulate what you hear on the guitar. Don´t spend the whole day listening to the guitar AND playing it.
Listen to any kind of music and then play.

Try to "noodle"... sit in front of your TV and play something..-. make it ENTERTAINING, make it FUN. try to play something you have never tried to play, somethin odd or weird ( not necessarily technically challenging )
Play simple stuff, but in many different ways.
try to get back to that feeling that made you pick up your guitar or attend GI in the ifrst place

Some random thoughts, y´know...
Eric

[Beavis]

Cheers EricV thanks for the advice, you have given me a couple of pointers. I just feel a bit outside the musical world. On the edge looking in and wont be accepted untill i have something good to show. (sorry if that seems strange) I hear music and so badley want to play it i end up gettting frustrated.

I will give it a go and let you know how i get on.

Cheers for the quick reply

Beavis

[EricV]

One more thing, and this goes for all of us:
Everyone might end up in a rut from time to time. It´s natural. Sometimes, it´s even a good thing ( cuz if youve in been in one, you can appreciate it way more once you´re out of it again ).
The hard part is to fight your way out of it, or be patient enough to wait till its over... don´t get frustrated, don´t give up.

It´s also normal to feel "outside of the musical world", or to feel inferior when you listen to your favorite players.
But you know what ? You ARE a musician, just as much as your role-models and idols. Sure, your technique might not be as evolved ( just an example ! ), or your songwriting might not be as developed, or you might lack their studio- or live-experience.
But you are a musician. You chose to pick up the guitar and work on it, and that makes you a musician. Maybe you´re not as famous as Vai, as fast as Yngwie or whatever... it doesn´t matter... you are a musician, you are on your way, and if ya keep going, you´ll end up writing, playing and recording your music.
I´m not talking about being an egomaniac. But you always gotta remember that you´re on your way, and that you´re in "the biz" etc. Be proud of that, remember it, don´t give up on it

*stepping off the soapbox*
Eric

[Chim_Chim]

That's some excellent advice from Eric.

I'll add my humble two cents....

Listen to different styles and get inspired by them rhythmically or melodically.I recommend some FUNK!

Next try to come up with a cool motif,riff,line,phrase or whatever in your head.Once you've gotten that first little germ of an idea from your head to your fingers RECORD IT.

Then try to hear the next line in your head but temper it towards simplicity.IOW stick 'close to the cuff' of the MELODY.Stay true to a simple melodic idea and let your ideas flow like this staying melodically 'close to the cuff'.Who cares if it's simple.It'll sound good.You can make it more technical in spots as an afterthought if you feel it needs it.But if it doesn't need it then don't hot rod it up.Stay true to the melody.

Record the ideas as they come.Take your time.Keep it simple.

Express YOUR own personal ideas in this way and progress slowly in your writing.You'll become a monster by staying simple and true.

It's music not a competition,

Chim

[Chim_Chim]

Music is a form of communication.

We aren't in competition with eachother when we speak (well some people might be but those people are annoying) nor should we be when communicating through music either.It should be as natural as the discussion in this thread.PERIOD.


"People living in competition,
all I want is to have my peace of mind..." ~ Boston

[metaljustice83]

this may or may not help but my thoughts are

do you enjoy music???

I'm assuming yes......so....do it!!!

if you enjoy it then do it. Maybe that'll make sense

try not to worry about being complecated


what I try to do is

PLAY MUSIC I WANT TO LISTEN TO
if you play music you want to listen to, then you've already won half the battle, the other half is everyone else, if you enjoy it then who cares if they like it.

Sit down and just close your eyes and think of yourself driving along in a convertible, what would you be listening to at the moment? Make something up like that. Something thats going to take YOU some place not 50 million other people, if it takes you some place then it will show in the music

I may read this later and realize its a bunch of mindless dribble, or realize its good advice, I hope its the latter.

Hope this little bit helps

[snufeldin]

"i am back studying"- that is your problem. "studying" not playing.

[ManuelBreu]

Hallo!
You said, you don't feel, what you are playing...well, I've had the same problem a time ago. But then I've found a brilliant workshop at vai.com : martian love secrets. Try it; The exercises may seem a little bit strange to you; but it really works...

MANU

[Shaman_Santana]

Also, concerning feel and the whole purpose of music, i really would recommend a book called 'Zen Guitar' by Philip Toshio Sudo. Its not a typical 'Zen' book - in that its not a religious book, it simply applies the Zen approach and way of looking at life to the guitar. It looks at the spiritual aspect of playing, which, really, is what feel is all about. ManuelBreu mentioned the workshops on vai.com, and looking at those its pretty clear that vai's approach to music is similar to that outlined in 'Zen Guitar'.

I Dont think im doing a fantastic job of describing the book to you, but its somthing that i've picked up when i've been stuck in ruts, and its certainly inspired me and reminded me what the purpose of my playing is. Check out the user reviews for more info on the book if ur interested, and you can find the book at amazon.co.uk simply by typing 'Zen Guitar'. :)

[Chim_Chim]

Personally I don't think spirituality has too much to do with it.
It's not that mystical...

It's merely about your sense of hearing and playing with authority.

Dynamics are best summed up in that one simple statement "play with authority".

And rub some FUNK on it! ;)

Chim :D

[Shaman_Santana]

Personally I don't think spirituality has too much to do with it. It's not that mystical...

Lol. well basically what i was trying to say was that u gotta feel what ur playing - u can either relate that to spirituality if thats your thing, or if its not then obviously you wont :). But still, as has been said earlier, if ur playing some up beat song like i dunno, 'Rock N Roll' by Lep Zep, n u feel down, the audience will pick up on how ur feeling down and the song wont seem so lively. Thats kinda what i meant about feel - like 'playing with authority' as u put it, its not necessarily a spiritual thing no - i just relate it to that because of my approach/beleifs. What i tried to do is suggest the book because i've found it inspiring and its helped me a lot when i've been down. Of course, everyone is different and it may not work the same for all. :)

[Danster]

Hey Beavis, I wish you good luck man. Giving advice is easy, I guess knowing what advice to take is hard. I'm not gonna offer any advice. I'm just gonna say that after reading your post, I thought to myself, "Damn, I'm too goal-oriented about this guitar stuff... I ought to be enjoying it more often." I left the computer, and went and played "Hoochie Coochie Man" (one of the few songs I have down pretty well) just for the enjoyment. And, it was nice. One of those, "It's not the destination, it's th... " well, you know.:)
Cheers,
Dan

[Bongo Boy]

Here are some thoughts--they may all be crap, and none may apply. But what the heck.

1. It's possible for a musician to prefer listening to the sort of music that he/she may not prefer to play.

2. Just because you play guitar doesn't mean guitar has to be the center of the musical universe, nor does guitar always have to be the lead or solo instrument for every piece of music. There are other things you could do with it I suppose.

3. A keyboard or a kazoo or a harmonica might let you concentrate on feel, melody or riff without all the baggage you associate with the guitar. Get it down with no constraints, goofing off till it puts a smile on your face. Then come back and 'implement' the thing with guitar.

I dunno. I am not a smart guy.

[potshot]

I think the keyboard idea is a good thing. Try a different take on writing the music... the keyboard will change the melodies you write and probably the feel of what you are playing as well. You could work this in with Bongo's second point. Maybe write something with the keys or piano as lead and then write something for the guitar to do as a support.

As for Bongo's first point, I think it happens all the time. Guitarists often say particular people inspired them, but you rarely hear the influence show and they don't play the same style of music. I think Petrucci claims Stevie Ray Vaughan as a strong influence...

[alistride]

The whole point about making music - in whatever form - is that it feels good (or right). It's not an exercise in dexterity or knowledge of scales and speed, although we all LOVE hearing that!
Go for a walk on a bright Autumn morning. Come back home. Pick up an acoustic. Grab the neck. What's the chord? Who cares? It sounds cool. Play another chord which is similar. Practically a verse there? Loop that, then wail yer guitar (like I wish I could) until the cows come home...
Be relevant about what you come up with - Route 66 is a great song, but I live on the A31, and it doesn't have the same resonance!

And don't stop! I've only just found this site, and I've dusted off the guitar! I'm too old - but I can still piss off the neighbours....

A

[Bongo Boy]

Originally posted by alistride
And don't stop! I've only just found this site, and I've dusted off the guitar! I'm too old - but I can still piss off the neighbours.......and THAT makes my day.

[metaljustice83]

how ya makin out beavis??

[hol0point]

I have been in one of these ruts recently. It happened when I lost my first jam partner and didnt have anyone to play with for a while. Seemed like nothing I wrote sounded good or it sounded like something else I had heard a million times. Then another friend of mine quit his band was able to jam with me. All of a sudden the stuff I wrote was new and I was getting positive feedback on it. But the best part was he would write some lyrics or simply play bass with what I was playing. I think playing with another person can make your own stuff seem so much better when others add their touch to it with thier instrument. Now I cant wait to work on the songs we wrote and make them better. Granted we arent going to be winning any grammys or anything but we have about 4 songs put together that are completely new and fresh. So my advice would be to find a playing parter you get along well with(preferably one that plays a different instrument then yourself) pick up a bottle of jack and just let it happen.

[Beavis]

Hi

Blimey, didn't think i would get this response, but it just shows that there is a good comunity on these forums. First off i would like to thank you all. I am moving on slighty, i finally did what some of you guys said and wrote some music that just sounded good, still having problems with recording, i get stuck on a 4 bar loop in cubase and repeat it till i hate it. Also i wan't to write funkier bass lines but i end up playing a pedal bass line.

Anyways, got to run will write a proper reply in a couple of days, just off home for a break.

Cheers

Beavis

[EricV]

Regarding writing stuff like interesting bass lines... I´d recommend to try to write them on a guitar. Give it a try. Sit down with the guitar and try to play something similar to what ya hear in your head. Don´t settle for pedaltones, go on till you find something you like.
That´s the point... if something isn´t the way you want it to be, continue playing it, getting closer to what you have in mind.
If you i.e. want to come up with a second part to some cool riff you have, try the same thing... play the riff you already have, and then slightly alter it... then alter it some more until you come up with something different.
Or, make up two chord progressions you like first, then start to come up with a riff based on those... you know, make sure you like what you write at all times. If you come up with something you´re not happy with, well, don´t keep it...

Eric

[snufeldin]

Personally I always find it frustrating when I show my jamming mates the songs I make up. I have the full arrangements in my head when I make them up alone, and when we try to put it together it just doesn't live up to my expectations. Plus my friends have some dick problems and want to stuff my songs full with technically difficult parts. They don't understand the less is more concept.

But I think it might be better if we make up songs together instead of me writing and then showing them. I'll leave my other ones at home until I find a penis-enviless band.

One more thing about song writing. I sometimes think the process of writing a song is more important than the actual finished product. I know that I'll make up a song and forget it the next day, or not remember exactly how it went, but it probably wasn't good enough to remember. However, you still want to try to write down the stuff you make most of the time. But this process is something that can be honed... steve morse always said that he made up a little song before concerts to warm up... it definitely helps with your melody construction.

[Ragman]

Hey Beavis,
i might not be the best guitar player, i might have a lot of trouble finding sounds that move me, but the fact is, i find them eventually. when im extremely frustrated with music and cant seem to get anything right that i want, i usually just turn on a nice warm distortion with heavy delay and reverb. sometimes ill just continuosly play one note, bending, treming, etc. what it does for me, it just sortof puts me in a sublime mood, makes everything seem nice and simple, and spiritual. i know i was reading the other replies and some people said it has nothing to do with spirituality, but i disagree. music moves me, music is all about emotion, happiness, sadness, anger, its all on the foundation of emotion, progression,... attitude. find your attitude, express it.
there are many times i hate what i play. but that doesnt make you a bad musician, and you'll find your way. it sounds to me like youve put a lot of time into playing and learning, and thats very respectable, i really dont know what else to say other than, youll find out what you want to do eventually, and youll feel great about it.
my favorite musician is devin townsend, who everyone should know started off with his band the wildhearts, and was asked by Vai to sing for him on a world tour, and sex and religion etc, he moved on to work on Strapping Young Lad, and his own solo projects and all that. most of his work is very emotional and spiritual, i find it very relaxing and very inspiring.
so try sitting in a dark room, with your eyes closed, playing guitar with a nice warm distortion and heavy delay and reverb and just express yourself, talk to yourself, see what it is you want to do.

thats about all i have to say, good luck beavis, but in the words of morpheus from the matrix, 'i do not believe it a matter of hope, simply a matter of time'

cheers

[mjo]

Hey gang ,
Man , is this a thread I can relate to ! I'm just off a 10 year hiatus from music. I do not , however , recommend that approach , I'm not half the player I used to be.
Beavis , do you think a fresh perspective might help ? It sounds like you know quite a bit about guitar / music. Do you have the opportunity to teach ? Maybe showing a "kid" some of the basics , seeing the satisfaction might rejuvenate your passion. How about some work around a local recording studio ?
You mentioned trying to figure out what a couple "guitar studs" were thinking , why they do what they do. Forget about that , for now. (if my goal was to play like Scott Henderson , I'd be frustrated all the time)

-just some thoughts from the "new kid"-
Take care ,
Mike

[Beavis]

Hey guys thanks alot, i have been doing alot of soul searching and thinking about the guitar, and what it comes down to is phrasing, i'm bored with mine. When i play improve i just use the same rhythms for the notes, even if i am in a different place on the neck or different scales etc i am always using the same phrasing, one problem is always ending my note on the 1 of the next chord and its normally a root or a 5th, how dull. But its the same everytime.

Also i ahve focused on soloing for so long that i ahve lost my way with chords, all my stuff sounds like a cheesy satriani rip off or some cheesy 80's vamp, how do i get modern. Also i would like to find out more about rhythm guitar. Where do i start.

Thanks again guys all the stuff you talk of is having a positive effect on my playing.

Here's another question, do you find it harder to absorb information as you get older, i remember when i was 16 learning melodic minor modes and funky Jazz chords and drop 2 voicing and all kinds of weird stuff and it just stored its self in my brain. Now 22 i can't take in anything, the musical universe is just too big and my brain is working overtime at trying to get all this stuff in my head but it just wont stay there, I have been reading up on minorisation and i like the concept but i keep forgetting bits and pieces, its like my brain is full up and when i try and learn something new it overflows and i forget somthing else. Have i filled up my Brain :confused:

Anyways i will keep this thread alive by adding replies. If anyone has some question about guitar playing please ask away, i am always able to help someone else but i can't see to help myself with the same info. Crazy

Peace

Beavis

[flathead]

Here's another question, do you find it harder to absorb information as you get older, i remember when i was 16 learning melodic minor modes and funky Jazz chords and drop 2 voicing and all kinds of weird stuff and it just stored its self in my brain. Now 22 i can't take in anything

LOL yeah you're a real old-timer. :)

Sorry I can't help help you, that sentence just struck me funny.:D

[Beavis]

LOL ok i'm not that old :cool:

[Spin 2513]

Originally posted by Beavis
I was just wondering if you guys could help me out. Basically i am totaly stuck. I am wondering around the large space that is my life, with no purpose or direction.

I have been playing the guitar for 9 years and i have studied alevel music, diploma at Guitar institute, grade 8 guitar and now doing the degree at GI (only becuase i didn't know what else to do) I am on the second year of the degree and i feel like the life and soul of me has been removed and drained out of me.

I remember coming out of the guitar institute after an intense year of learning and having good guitarists and tutors to inspire and push me further and further, i remember playing the end of year concert at ocean in hackney, playing a harmonic with my tounge :) I had balls i wasn't afraid of what i played and i had confidance in my playing and enjoyed playing. Now i am here 2 years on and you would hae thought i could have moved on. well i haven't except now i have no confidance. I live in a house with 3 other guitarist and i feel left out., I have done years of wood shedding and have done the technique thing and sweeping (all done on the diploma) and i am just board, i see nothing in my playing that anyone would want to listen to. Its really sad, how can i go to a jam session when i hate what i am doing. I just see the guitar as a huge Major scale with all my licks and things. Melodies have no feel because i am just joining the dots. I play where the scale goes not where the music goes, if you know what i mean.

Unfortuantly if any of you guys look at my profile you will see this is the 3rd time i have come to the board for help and i am starting to wonder wheather i have any place in the guitar field. At the moment i don't feel i should be here.

Also i ahve taken a break, i messed about for 3 months over the summer and now i am back studying i have fallen back in to the same old things. I ahve brought cubase and some recording equipment to hopfully get the creative juices flowing but its not happening. I just can seem to play anything i like. Even just a riff, i compare it to something i ahve heard. I am a very logical and calculated person mentally, i can play the guitar form a mathmatical perspective. But this doesn't seem to help when playing real music.

I just need to sort a way of enjoying the guitar, i ahve tried to listen to other types of music and i just want to work out what they are doing, i have recently done a ritchie kotzen and greg howe overload, i can play a few of their licks but i want to get in their minds and fine out what they are thinking when they improvise, how they compose and write. I want to know why they do things but i can't work out the answers.

I can't practice what i preach, i talk to alot of guitarist about problems when playing and can offer some advice and encoragment, but when i am sitting on my own i feel like smacking my head on a brick wall.

I am online alot now so i will be watching this thread and adding to it my progress,

Any help welcome, please offer you advice.

sorry this is long and might sound confusing but thats what i feel like as a guitarist.

Cheers

If anyone has article (the ibreathmusic one have been a help) websites or anything that may help i would appreciate a link.

Beavis

You hate the music . Well that's a start.Some ones bound to like it .
First get a Death Metal ditortion pedal , play it through any amp ,and play harmonic minor,and diminished, on the low strings
play harmonic minor in A minor with e open string pedal tone .then use F# harm ,D diminished (frets0,3,6,912)A diminished(frets1,4,7,10)E diminished(0,2,5,8,11) Make your own scales ,play with one hand ,using hammerons and pull offs .try some patterns with just tremolo picking on the low strings ,use one finger .use minor 3 and flat 5 intervals , use the same scales as Yngwie ,but keep Slayer haunting the chaple in mind . play the notes from acoustic guitar chords,picking 32ed notes on the notes in the chord individually . Play free .

[DracWell]

I have those guitar-hating-periods once or twice a year, and they can last for 1-2 months or so. What I've finally realised is this: just leave it be, don't force the writing, it will come again. I've just recently come out of such a period, and to my great joy, our other guitarist did the same! Man, we have been writing soo much good stuff it makes me cry. Well almost anyway. This and the fact that I got dumped, that made me realise that the only thing that'll always be with me in my life is music, and I only make music for my self, if someone else likes it, great, but _I_ have to like it.

I'm a little down when it comes to me lead playing, phrasing and stuff. But I'm working on it. Like, I'm totally in love with the feel Thordendal get's in his improvised solos, so I thought, why not write a backing track that'll induce that feeling into my playing and then just jam over it until I hit the hot spot :)

When music and playing makes me feel what I feel now I really realise that life _is_ grand.

[Apple-Joe]

Seems like you've got a great bunch of suggestions already. I read through quite some of the posts, and it sounded fair.

I got one concrete recommendation myself as well. I often compose music on the computer, but I also happen to test it with my guitar occasionally.

Sometimes when I experience a certain lack of motivation, I find it refreshing to do something completely different. If you find yourself often working, let's say, in the natural minor scale, or just the major. Well, any scale really, as long as you usually "stick to the rules", this method I have in mind will be very refreshing:

Either, if you know music theory, spend 5 seconds mentioning some random chords, like "Cm7 - F#diminished - G - Ab6" - and you'll hopefully end up with something a little more random, and perhaps refreshing, than the music you explore usually. Record the chords, then improvise freely over it.

If you don't focus that much on music theory, just forget about the chord names, and pick some random chords by ear. Then do the same, record them, and improvise a melody.

Maybe some intentional dissonance will do good too?

The core of this is to be experimental. Forget about any 'given norm', rather try to explore what you usually wouldn't.

Oh, and a final tips, which you probably agree on yourself, it might be an idea to focus on the rhythm. A steady rhythm could make it more interesting - well, if not you want to go completely random on the rhythm too! Your choice.

[Romp]

I was gonna say basically the same thing as Apple-Joe. Randomization could be a big help to you. My teacher has often suggested (although I've actually yet to do this) rolling dice for ideas. For example, take a specific key, like G-major. The diatonic chords in that key are Gmaj, Am, Bm, Cmaj, Dmaj, Em, and F#dim. So roll a die, say it comes up 4. Then roll it again, maybe you get a 2. Roll again, another 4. Then 3, then 6, then 2 then 5 or something like that. (Six sided dice, remarkably, save you from that icky diminished chord.*)

So you've got 4-2-4-3-6-2-5, which aligns with the chord progression C, Am, C, Bm, Em, Am, D. So then play it. It may sound like crap (which this looks like it would since it doesn't include the home chord of G,) but the point is that it breaks you out of cyclical thinking without having to imitate something else. Roll the dice again and find elements that sound good and new to you, and build from there.

*It occurs to me that leaving the diminished chord out could be monstrously bad advice, since you're looking for "new" sounds. That being the case, you could just roll two dice and use one chord for each die unless you roll a 7, in which case use the diminished chord.