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View Full Version : metranome who wat where and basicly why



luke_hull
03-12-2004, 07:42 PM
metranome trouble
hey am i stupid. dont ansewr that q but ive been told to build up my speed i should use a metranome so i got one but i cant focus on them both at once so im thinking have i or havnt i had a click so i was wondering if one of you guys had some advise for me on using metranome any help would be greatly welcomed. i just dont get how to concetrate one the click and my guitar. chears from luke p.s wats ur opinion on fender mexican stratocasters

Unhorizon
03-12-2004, 07:56 PM
Well, you shouldn't really be totally conentrating on both. I concentrate mostly on my guitar and keeping all the notes even and just use the metrenome to make sure I'm not speeding up or slowing down. So I basically "check" myself every measure(usually every 4 beats) to make sure I'm in unison with the metrenome.

LarryJ
03-12-2004, 08:06 PM
The only reason anyone would think your stupid is because you have terrible grammer, spelling, and dont use correct sentence formatting. If your from a non-english speaking country then that's of course forgiven...anyways onto the questions.


1) Mexican strats are fine instruments. My first guitar 4 years ago was one, and I swear it still plays better than my expensive ESP. It's a great instrument and sounds and plays well through anything. If your looking for more of a heavy rock sound, you might want to consider putting in a humbucker in the bridge or maybe upgrading guitars to something with more features (like say a usuable whammy bar)

2) You should be subdividing beats with the metronome when you play. For instance, if you want to play whole notes, you play one note per every click. Either watch for the light or ideally listen for the click and you will soon enough 'lock into' the rhythm. This might take time if you have no rhythm, but you can develop it easily so stick with it. If you want to play quarter notes then, (4 picks per click) or 8th notes (8 per click) etc. You'll be suprised how much more difficult this makes it. You wont be set on 200 when playing quarter and 8th notes, you'll be set on something like 70 or 80, and it will be just as difficult.

The point of the metronome is to stay in time, break down beats, and give you something to look forward to: the upping of the number. Set goals for yourself (small ones, like say, increasing quarter notes cleanly by 15 bpm a week) and work towards them. Almost all of Eric V's articles on this site deal with this, especially the practice and right hand picking ones, be sure to check those out. Good luck with everything,
-Larry

luke_hull
03-12-2004, 08:13 PM
sorry about the gramer lary ill take my next time im just a realy bad speller and i try to write to fast so sorry about that i make it neat next time

JeffN
03-13-2004, 12:22 AM
Some punctuation would help too. :)

Looks like I've been using my metronome wrong all this time.
I've been treating every click as a quater note...so, a whole note would last for four clicks and so on.

Edited for punctuation :D

LarryJ
03-13-2004, 03:13 AM
I guess the keyword is "Nexttime" :D

I didn't mean to bash you or anything like that. However, it really doesn't take much to hit the shift key to capitalize words or the apostrophe key either. When you type like that people don't take you seriously. You wouldn't write like that on a test, would you? So why go to the effort of typing like that then?

The metronome is definitly a helpful tool, but it takes alot of persistance to stick with it and actually work with it, it's not the most exciting of aspect of playing, so good luck to everyone when using one, I know I still rarely break it out...

The Bash
03-13-2004, 04:31 AM
You can use the metronome anyway you like, the click could stand for anything you'd like it to. Just so long you know what your doing :)

Generally it's set to click 1 beat which in something/4 time (like 4/4) 1 beat would be the quarter note.

Quarter note= 1 beat thus 1 click
eight note= 1/2 beat thus 2 notes per click.
sixteenth note= 1/4 beat thus 4 notes per click.
eight note triplets= 1/3 beat thus 3 notes per click
16th note triplets= 1/6 beat thus 6 notes per click.

In something/8 time (like 6/8) the eight note would get one beat, the quarternote 2 beats etc.

Sometimes it's easier to take a 16th note triplet lick (6 notes per click) that's diffucult to play and pretend it's eight note triplets.
Why? Because it's very diffucult for most people (depending on the level of experience) to keep soild time once the metronome gets down in the 60's cause of the length of time between the beats. It gets even more diffucult as you get into the 50's. Etc.
So instead of trying to play 16th note triplets at say 44 it's easier to keep time playing 8th note triplets at 88.
I just used that as an example same relationship is true of 8th notes and 16th notes etc.
It's just easier to keep soild time if your above 60 on the metronome.
So use it however you want, or need it. Just (like I said) know what your clicking.

zeppenwolf
03-13-2004, 07:17 AM
Originally posted by LarryJ
The only reason anyone would think your[1] stupid is because you have terrible grammer[2], spelling, and dont[3] use correct sentence formatting. [4]If your[5] from a non-english[6] speaking country then that's of course forgiven...anyways onto the questions.

1) you're (you are)
2) grammar ( and then comes "spelling"! Hahaha! )
3) don't
4) Two spaces after a period
5) See #1
6) English

:) Sorry dude, I just couldn't resist! :)

I do agree with you, actually. Assuming that kind of post comes from a normal English-speaking kid, it says to me that the person wants your help but can't be bothered to spend a keystroke to make it readable for you. That wouldn't be "cool". On the other hand, I've run across more than a few dyslexics on the internet whose posts resemble the above but they just can't help it, so we should not always assume...

Eden

luke_hull
03-13-2004, 10:47 AM
Okay I get the idea about the grammar ill try more to improve it. But in any case thanks a lot for your advice people. One last thing I mentioned a Fender stratocaster (Mexican) what are those single coil hum buckers like thanks again

zeppenwolf
03-13-2004, 03:09 PM
Originally posted by luke_hull
One last thing I mentioned a Fender stratocaster (Mexican) what are those single coil hum buckers like thanks again
The MIM guitars have been of excellent quality, except for some problems in the first years they started there. There is a thread at FDP (Fender Discussion Page) questioning the quality of the current amps (which are mostly MIM), but that's just one guy whining so far, so...

For advice on what HB to put in a SC spot, the Seymour Duncan Forums are very active and very helpful:

http://seymourduncan.com/forum/index.php?s=

Actually the whole SD site is very helpful. If you're into wiring or knowing what's going on they have very extensive FAQ, schematics, etc... Hth,

Eden

Bongo Boy
03-14-2004, 02:22 PM
Back to the concentration issue that you raised. To me it's a bit like tapping your foot and playing at the same time. One big difference is that you have control over your foot, but you are doing two things at once. It takes some practice--the first time I used the metronome I was very surprised at how hard it was--especially since that thing doesn't stop with you make a mistake.


The point of the metronome is to...give you something to look forward to: the upping of the number.It may even be of more interest to look forward to playing in time with others and/or backing tracks.

LarryJ
03-14-2004, 08:15 PM
I walked right into that one didn't I?:o

Gunnan
03-15-2004, 01:44 PM
One strategy that my guitar teacher taught me was that you split up your ears / brain into LEFT side / ear for metronome and Right side / Ear for playing.. he also told me ( sence I have a problem with getting infront of the beat ) that I should play lazy, or try and play just on the back end of the beat, that realy helped me out...

So 1.. Listen to the metronome, while playing, eventualy you will kinda get a tick tock in your head if you do it for half an hour or so you will realy start feeling a pull.

2. One thing I came up ( not saying that I was the first :) )with is just strumming muted chords or whatever at the tempo with a downstroke landing on every click, then id start making noises in my head with or with my mouth on what felt like the up beat of that click , landed on the upstroke of my pick, once I get my hand / foot / brain moving with the metronome then Ill start playing the thing im working on..

Another funny thing my guitar teacher pointed out was that you can put your foot under something ( I use the other chair in my room ) and when tapping your foot along with the metronome hit the chair with the top of your foot there by creating a upbeat for all the down beats of the metronome.

Now if you guys could just explain to me how to play something other then evenly subdivided beats like quarter / eights / sixteenths ( example the intro to little wing, red house, and every other song id love to play well ) then I would be eterenaly grateful. ( I guess the question is how could I go about praticing those phrases with a metronome? )

smallbusrider
03-15-2004, 02:22 PM
Yeah, I was going to correct Larry J too on his grammer(sic) lol.
anyway, even though i have a pretty good command of spelling and the english language, i do not really pay all that much attention to these criteria, as long as my post is readable. I find it much easier to type that way and we shouldnt be too concerned about this(IMHO anyway :))

so's untile latere i while werk on me speling and sentance stricture....lol

seeya all ! bye!

Bongo Boy
03-17-2004, 02:29 PM
Now if you guys could just explain to me how to play something other then evenly subdivided beats like quarter / eights / sixteenths (example the intro to little wing, red house...The transcription I have for Red House is in 12/8 time, and for me is 'metronomically challenging' because of the 4/4 phrasing. What I mean is, looking at the first two bars, I show 12 eighth-notes per bar which wouldn't be a problem--you could just set the click to 6 beats per measure and treat it like 6/4.

But, those two bars (as an example) are emphasized as though they were quarter-note triplets in 4/4 (that's how I see it, anyway), further emphasized by the bass.

If you can set a down-beat click, then I'd probably try light clicks as though it were 4/4 with the down-beat on 2 and 4, then do the 'triplets' in your head:

1-(2)-(3)-2-(2)-(3)-3-(2)-(3)-4-(2)-(3)

If the metronome has more options, then I'd do a light 12/8 click (ride?) with down beat on your 4 and 10 (snare?)--just like the percussion.

Does this make sense? How would other folks do it?

DDTonFire
03-17-2004, 11:14 PM
I love my Fender Mexican Standard Strat. Its quality is excellent for the price and it plays quite nice. If I had a complaint against it, it would be the noisy single-coils. I play some metal (e.g. Dream Theater, Led Zeppelin, Van Halen, etc.) so the pickups are not quite suited for my purpose.

oRg
03-20-2004, 04:12 AM
Chances are someone already answered your question but I just wanna put my 2 cents in anyways. All metronomes do is layout a beat for you. Some metronomes can also give you meters as well (i.e. 4/4, 4/2, 6/8, etc etc). Then there's some metronomes out there that can give you even more complex beats (i.e. 9/8, 17/16 which I've only seen Jethro Tull use). Most musicians just stick with the basic beats but there are the few and brave such as Paul Gilbert, Shawn Lane, and Frank Zappa which dare to be different and try the more complex rythms and polyrhythms(metrics). It just establishes a beat for you so you know what an Eighth and Sixteenth note sounds like at different tempos, measured in beats per minute (bpm). Sometimes you'll run across some tabs with something that says q=120 which basically means there are 120 quarter notes played per minute and from that you can feel out how to put a song together and everything else like that. But that pretty much explains it. As far as Mexican Stratocasters go...I'm more of a fan of the American Strat Special /w Seymour Duncan pickups. I'm a man of lead and much gain so these work pretty nice for me. I'm not too familiar with Mexican Strat's anyways.

DDTonFire
03-23-2004, 02:18 AM
Dream Theater are the KINGS of wierd beats. Hands down.
e.g:

Metropolis Pt. I meter changes:
9/8 - 7/8 - 19/16 - 13/16 - 7/8

Then there's the Dance of Eternity:
5/16 - 7/16 - 5/16 - 7/16 - 10/16 - 4/4 - 7/8 - 3/4

The key thing about DT is that they make it sound good and easy!

UltimaRage
03-26-2004, 03:36 PM
A metronome isn't necesarry, but if you use one for like a week, you will notice a difference. Not paticularly in speed, but in timing. I should seriously start using mine. It just seems like a hassle and I'd much rather mess around. I still don't completely understand how to use a metronome, either.

LarryJ
03-26-2004, 04:31 PM
19/16 time really isn't a very difficult beat. It becomes very easy when you break it down.

Mike explains this one in detail on his 'liquid drum theater' dvd set, and it becomes incredibly simple, I guess its all in how you look at it. The same goes for all odd-time signatures probably.

I alwasys though YYZ by rush was a way out there tune. DT uses odd time signatures alot, but the whole band follows it in YYZ or the Ytse Jam, which makes it sound much more crazy than the songs mentioned above.

LarryJ
03-26-2004, 04:38 PM
I should mention that 19/16 isn't a difficult beat, broken down (it just looks insane) but it is a real bitch to count! This is especially true at high tempos (like DT use) mike loses his place several times trying to keep up with the counting, usually he just plays it and does it in his head so its not as big a deal.

szulc
03-26-2004, 06:14 PM
The real importance of the metronome is learning to play in time. Not everyone is gifted with a sense of meter. The metronome hlep drill in the idea of consistent time division for the rest of us. Use it to learn how to evenly divide time until you get a 'feel' for time division.

Cuno
03-26-2004, 07:39 PM
Yep, szulc is right - you don't wanna develop 'accordion timing' :D