Help with picking technique!!

[Shreddy Kruger]

I'd like this to be answered by someone who has been playing for a while, or if you havent but can play pretty fast with an impecable technique (meaning fluidly).

I've been playing guitar for about 9 years. Recently ive noticed that the faster stuff I play (becker, Angelo, etc.) I tend to start all of my picking with a downstroke, instead of 100% up-down-up-down technique. I've basically been doing this for a while and so my d-u-d-u technique is shot. I've been practicing this the past few days to re-learn it, but now it seems that my playing all together has declined and now im frustrated.

My question is, should I embrace the all down stroke playing (only when really fast though), or should I start practicing the true d-u-d-u?

thanks!
SK

[Shady]

I Believe James Hattfeild Only Uses Downstroke. And Does It Pretty Fast. I Have Tried Both I Use The D U D U Because It Feels More Natural. But Downstoke Only Seems To Sound Thicker-heavier And Seems To Be More Accurate For Me. But I Always Say Play What Feels Most Natural And You'll Get There With A Smile On Your Face.

[Koala]

Hey SK, theres only one thing you oughta consider. Is this alternate picking of yours stopping, slowing or messing up your playing? If not, then dont change it. Chanaging picking techniques can take months at a time. If the way you pick works for you, keep it and youll be just fine.

hope this helps,

[Koala]

Hey Shady, I think SK refers to lead playing. Hetfield does play all downstrokes, but thats for rythm, and i must add he can do it quite fast, but soloing with all downstrokes is pretty inefficient.

[Shreddy Kruger]

Yes, i was talking about lead play Shady, but thanks for the reply.

And sorry, when I said "all down" picking, i didnt mean "all down" picking, hehe. I meant, starting every new string with a down stroke, then continuing the u-d-u-d pattern. For instance, it could be: d-u-d- (new string) d-u-d (ns) d-u-d etc.

As far as whether the downward picking is messing up my playing, it is and it isnt. I can play remarkably fast like that, but not with every lick. LIke, i can play super fast like that with a 3 note per string lick, but if I play a 3-5-5 note lick (for example, 3 notes on the low E to 5 notes on the A to 5 notes on the E, etc) I can't play it as fluidly.

Ehh, basically its hard to explain. Sometimes I can play it and sometimes I cant. I guess my technique has changed so much in the last few years (going from not so fast to playing pretty fast and learning advanced arrpeggio licks in a very short time) that I just need to adjust more fully.

SK

[oRg]

I ran into the same problem a few months ago and depending on the kinda day I'm having I still kinda struggle with it but one thing I do is practice some pentatonic licks starting with d u d u and then practicing them using u d u d but in a different position. I'm not sure if you'd like practicing this but another thing I do is play some meshuggah. With some of their songs they start on an up strokeend with a down then start with a down and end on an up.

[Unhorizon]

I think what you guys are doing is economy picking. It's kind of an alternative to alternate picking. Instead of going d-u-d-u-d-u no matter what, you basically start each string thats higher (E to A, A to D, D to G, G to B, or B to E) with a downstroke no matter what, and each string thats lower (E to B, B to G, G to D, D to A, or A to E) with an upstroke no matter what. This is less movement than alternate picking and more 'economical' I guess. I don't use it because like you said, it works very well for some things (3 NPS), and not so well for everything else. Now if you can get it so that you can play any picking sequence like this perfectly, there is obviously no reason why you should change. But, if you keep having trouble for a long time and this kind of picking isn't working for you, I would recommend trying alternate picking for a little while. At first it will probably feel wierd if you have never done it and playing licks with outside picking (playing an upstroke on a higher string to downstroke on lowerstring or vice versa) might feel silly. I know it did for me when I first started.
When I first learned about AP I wonder why anyone would move more then they had to hit a string. But I started using AP after a while and found it much smoother and MUCH more reliable. You can be sure your picking hand won't get too confused when learning new lines and you won't have to think about it before hand. I sound like I'm trying to sell you alternate picking but it's just because I think most guitarists use it (not meaning that it's better, just more reliable) and also helps you keep a good sense of time too. So try AP for a little while, and start slow, or don't try AP and disregard this post.

[GuitarLausing]

i do the same thing as SK... THe economy picking thing..
It works for me pretty fine, and it doesn't screw up my playing so i dont worry..
But still, if i go strict alternate picking i really have to concentrate and its not fluidly.
But i guess it's just practice pratctise practise if you wanna get good at it.

And everytime i make a mistake i mentally kick myself, because i'm like "that's the most simple, basic thing in the world!! Why can't i do it!! ARGH! (talking about AP)"
Am I wrong here? Am I underestimating the strange power of alternate picking?

[oRg]

I was talking about starting on the low E and working my way up to the high E by doing a U D U D and then doing the same thing except doing D U D U.

[Alan(Lost)]

Basically anytime you want to play things like 3-note per string licks really fast, use economy picking. All guitarists have to have alternate picking in their vocab; it's ludicrous not to. Economy picking really is only necessary for high speed stuff. Listen to lots of Malmsteen for ideas on it; he uses it all over the place.

I suggest you do both. For really fast 3-nps patterns, use economy (for speeds that alternate isn't possible). But also really push your alternate playing the same licks. Once I go past 130BPM playing sextuplets using alternate picking, I use economy because alternate is just too fast for me to do 130BPM+.