Band problems

[Lexavier]

I am in A band with probably my best friend , hes the drummer, im the guitarist, and hes been playing for 2 years and hes quite good. the thing is hes good at "obeying" by the book, not thinking outside of the box. problem being , the drummer is supposed to be the time keeper but its the other way around, if i listen to something a couple of times and try to cover the song you know its pretty easy to match the timing and be dead on(dont take that the wrong way, i didnt intend for that remark to make me sound like im saying im steve vai or whatever),my friend cannot do that , i dont know if he doses off or something but ill see him counting for example , if you listen to "school" by nirvana , it starts out with guitar and the drums come in at the end of the fourth measure. my friend pretty much always comes in wrong and im trying to figure out if hes counting why he cant do it. when i play i just play and not worry about the timing, i dont really count because i dont have trouble with being on time. but ill notice with an original song we have ill start the guitar out and then he will count with the hi hat, but it will be wrong , ill be playing at my tempo and then he will come in with the hi hat and make the tempo go slower, then it will go faster , then slower , and he does not notice this. when i try to point things out to him , and help him , when he does something wrong he flips out , i want to be in a band with the kid but he hates help and he hates when people "correct" him . i have been trying to make it work you know i am being really patient with him, we practice everyday of the week, 3 or 4 hours everyday, but i dont want my playing ability to lessen because im trying to keep up with his improper timing, and to be honest im sick and tired of him throwing his sticks and drum chair all over the practice space.

[phantom]

hey-o,
.. and welcome to the forums.

you wrote a hell of a lot.. :D .

to keep the answer short:

the solution to your problem is "learn to count!".

the reasons are pretty obvious:

- music is divided into measures and beats. they are countable to guide you and the rest of the band.
- if your drummerfriend counts and you don't, you don't have the same language to argue in. if you learn the rules, chances for a good rehearsel are better.
- maybe you are the one who is "off" find out by working with your drummer , not against him. take a metronome or something like that as a reference.

good luck


p.s.: ....i almost forgot: practice to tap your foot in time! a pretty valuable advice i must say.. take it :D !

[Lexavier]

see the thing is , i use a metronome alot, i know that sounds contradictory considering i say im not a time man , but when i say i dont pay attention to time i mean i dont pay attention to what signature its in, when a song is covered , i spend an hour molding it into my head . I have asked/ offered the kid to use a metronome, and ive used one myself just to set the bar straight, but he only wants to use it 2 or three times and then drop it then its back to point A. its not a sense of going against the kid , im trying to figure out a way to help him. trust me the last thing i want to do is shoot him down , so like i said i have used the metronome before and it works then. did i mention the anger problem? we played "school " by nirvana and he came in wrong the first three times, so i said " you want to use a metronome so we can get this dead on ? you know perfect it?" , in the nicest way possible and thats when he started getting pissed " you dont think im good or something?" just **** like that man , im completley patient with the kid. and the tapping the foot technique works , i use it with bossa nova alot aha. :D

[sugarbee]

Have you tried to talk to him outside of rehearsal time? In a more neutral space where there aren't any other people around? Maybe talking about his "problems" in front of the rest of the band is hard for him to deal with. Have you talked with the rest of the bandmates about it to see what they think? A difficult drummer who has issues keeping time would make things difficult for a band, I can totally see that. Maybe the key lies in finding the right time and place and try to have an open honest discussion with him. Ask him point blank if he gets angry, why do you get so angry when I mention this? I'm just trying to help. Is there something else bothering you? It sounds like maybe there is another issue complicating this. It could be as simple as dude doesn't like criticism but it could be something else too. I duno, but good luck!

[UltimaRage]

Tell him you'll quit if he won't listen to your advice.

[Jergason]

In my band, the drummer is definatly the most talented one, and I wouldn't have it any other way. Having a good drummer makes everything else a whole lot easier. Our bass player has bad rhythm when he plays by himself, but our drummer does a great job of helping him play in time. A drummer who can't play in time throws off the whole band. So if there is absolutely no way he can count right and stay in time, you will never be able to have a successful band. He either needs to learn how to do it, or you need to find a different drummer.