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View Full Version : I AM THE MAD ARTIST! Seeking others like myself



redmunk
08-22-2005, 10:01 PM
Well, let me have a think. I am becomming increasingly aware that I am really odd. I mean, I've been to art college and to music college thinking that I would find interesting and insightful people who see the world as i do, but no. They all drink and smoke and care about little else, and don't seem to have any awareness of other people, love and happiness and all the important things in life.

So every so often in my life i sit down and I write letters to people, or i try and tell them the things that i really feel misunderstood about. I tell people the thoughts that are in my head. You know how people often think about things, but they worry that no-one else is thinking the same thing and that they must be really odd for thinking it. Then what usually happens is that they tell someone and that someone understands what they are saying and they realise that they are not all that different after all. well, that doesn't happen to me. People don't understand what I'm talking about and i can feel them trying. I don't feel bad about it anymore. I don't think I mind. Sometimes i get lonely because of it. Not because i'm alone, but because no-one understands what I'm saying. I don't mean that in a cliched, self deprecatiin nobody-understands-my-pain sort of way, because it's not like that. It's just from experience of people thinking I'm quite mad that come to this conclusion.

Well, I suppose it's better when people think you're quite mad but they think you're a 'beautiful freak' like one of my friends at art college. I just wrote to some friends about songwriting, one of whom was really someone that i thought might just think like me and they didn't understand the letter. Most of my friends seem to end up being people who have something else wrong with them that means other people can't understand them either. So we don't understand each other exactly but we at least have that in common.

So i have an idea. In fact, I might even make it a separate post.

Are you feeling crazy in your art?
Are you feeling that you know you're right of that you're making sense but other people don't understand you.
No self loathing, just genuine oddness please. People who are just baffled by the fact that other people just don't get it.

If this is you, WRITE TO ME directly! We'll probably get on fabulously! Or if you're not that confident just reply to the post.

phantom
08-23-2005, 07:20 AM
I don't understand what you are saying. ;)

I guess i'm odd - but maybe i'm not and others just make me feel like that.
Is there a difference? I rarely know anyone i'd consider normal. Even those "averages" in the office here can't be normal. As much as i think they are nuts in their way they probably (or pretty surely) think "that Sven guy is a looney".


They all drink and smoke and care about little else, and don't seem to have any awareness of other people, love and happiness and all the important things in life.
Love? I have so much that it hurts sometimes with an awareness factor 9 (on a scale from 1 to 10) AND i drink and smoke. -don't know how that relates to feeling odd-
The importance of things in life can vary widely depending on many different circumstances .. i guess.

If i feel crazy in my art? Hmm.. erm.. yep it makes me crazy to see that playing guitar is still so darn difficult after all the years of practice. i wouldn't say what i do is crazy 'cause it feels natural to me. if others think it's crazy? oh well.
in general "strange" depends on the feedback you get in life.. everyday.
If you would be the only person walking the planet, nothing or everything would be odd.

UKRuss
08-23-2005, 08:05 AM
That is because you are a mad bastard Sven;)

No seriously, I think if I get you right, perhaps writing letters to people explaining things you want to tell them is simply indicative of a struggle in learning how to communicate effectively with people verbally.

I would think it a little odd if someone wrote me a letter about an issue simply because I would prefer they come to talk to me about it and secondly it gives me a chance to respons and enter into a debate. if I get a letter it's a fait a compli I cannot respond.

We are all odd, but I like to call it individual. I am an individual, I am unique, there is no-one else like me. I like that and I enjoy who I am.

Thats not to say I don't have insecurities or fears, but the fun is overcoming them and endearing myself to others.

I've also found regardless of my own penchant for liking or disliking others habits doesn't necessarily give me casue to dismiss their value as a potential friend.

My experience is everyone has something to give and it's the finding out thats the fun part.

I don't feel crazy in my art at all, I find music a highly structured logical expression which defines my emotions for me. In that I find discipline, routine and a learning experience which is enriching but in no way makes me feel insane or odd in any way.

They key is to find a way to make others understand you, social techniques are of utmost importance and I think I recent study i read about (don't ask me where or when) suggested that children who develop their social skills and communication skills early in life are more succesful in their chosen paths later in life.

have a think about how you communicate and see if there is something you can do to help your own situation too.

Sorry for the preach:D

LarryJ
08-23-2005, 08:09 AM
I dont understand why people like rap music. At all. I do not find any musicality in any of it, even the so called "underground good stuff" ... I can't relate and think so many other artists can write way better lyrics and better melodies and all that. I dont care how good some rapper thinks he is at busting out rhymez, or how much of a bad mofo he is writing about it is just stupid.

I have an argument with just about everyone I meet over this. And they think I'm weird for liking rock...

LarryJ
08-23-2005, 08:13 AM
Oh yea, and what you seem to be refferring to above is what people call 'maturity'.

Most college kids have the mentality of 10 year olds when left to their own means. It sucks, I deal with it everday as a student, but by the same token that doesn't mean you have to go out of your way to be weird and 'not fit in' like I see so many people try to do. That just seperates you and makes you out to be the oddball until you believe it. We're not talking about soul mates, we're talking about people you can be friendly with, discuss music or sports or girls and stuff with.

UKRuss
08-23-2005, 08:33 AM
Mmmmm girls...

UKRuss
08-23-2005, 08:33 AM
Mmmm stuff...

phantom
08-23-2005, 08:38 AM
Mmmm sports...

redmunk
08-23-2005, 10:02 AM
hmm, thinkety-think. There's actually quite a lot to think about here.

To phantom I say, I suppose if you feel crazy you must be. I personally don't feel crazy, but the feedback i get from life says otherwise. I don't understand why people aren't open.

To larry J I say: RE:"we're talking about people you can be friendly with, discuss music or sports or girls and stuff with."
I know what you mean. I'm good at that and spend my life talking to boys about guitars, music, girls and to girls about boys, music and clothes. What i don't understand is how to get beyond that. How do you transform those ordinary people into people that you can talk about everything with? That's what's called "making friends" I'm assuming. It's confusing because it could just be me who's socially crap, but I see so many people around me who are "friends" but that just seems to mean they talk about surface stuff all the time and never go deeper. Othertimes I've heard people say that after a year of being friends with someone they've finally been able to talk with them about something emotional. To me, that's strange. I would love to be able to talk with anyone about anything and listen to anything they have to say but it seems to me like other people don't want that. Is this because i'm socially terrible? No I think not because I HAVE met people who i click with and who i can talk to for ages about important things. It's just that none of them are musicians and it would be nice to be able to talk to someone about music properly. I'm in a college full of musicians but i don't seem to be able to find that person. The other week a lecturer came into college and I noticed that he might be a bit like me in some ways so i asked him a question in class which was what other people would call "strange", but he understood. And i understood his answer, but he looked right at me the whole time he was giving it because I think there was an understanding between us that we were the only 2 people in the room who would get it. It felt good to have someone else recognise it, but also bad because someone who was older, mature and more experienced than me had also come to the conclusion that we're on our own if we're gonna talk in this way.

As far as trying to be odd on purpose, I have to say it is a thing which happened a little (just because it's the only alternative if you can't make yourself fit in) in High School but I'm long past that.

I also don't like rap music.

To UKRuss I say, you have a lot of very good points. As to letter writing, it IS a socially crap thing to do. I very rarely write to people i could actually be talking to. Sometimes i do if there's a reason, like if I have an idea in the night, so obviously i can't tell anyone then but i might as well write them a letter about it. Why not? I used to write to my best friend a lot because she has M.E. and can only talk for a half hour a week so email is a good way of communicating with her the rest of the time. Recently i wrote to someone because I've known them for a few months and in that time we've had a couple of really decent conversations but the rest of the time it's all surface stuff. Try as i might, i can't seem to get that deeper person to resurface. I figured, if she's afraid of that, then doing from behind a computer screen might make it easier for her. I was right, her deeper personality did come out in the reply, but she didn't understand what my original email was about.

I agree that everyone has something to give, but the problem i have is finding it. I don't have a problem with the fact that other people smoke or drink at all, if that's what you mean by "other people's habits". I'd have a problem with people liking collecting socks, or drinking orange juice if that's all the did every night so that every time i tried to talk to them about art or feelings they would just go on about socks and orange juice. Then whe they took you to the Orange Sock club they would just sit there and talk about nothing in particular until 2am and then tell you how great the night out has been. If you get my meaning that is. I mean that the people i know use alcohol as a way of insulating themselves from intimacy, and that's why i find it difficult. Recently my girlfriend said to me "people do need a few drinks to loosen up". I said i didn't think it was true. She said "oh no, it's true. People need it to loosen their inhibitions. You don't have any so it doesn't make a difference". Well, I don't it mind if that's true..but hardcore getting drunk doesn't have the same effect.


Now then. RE:"have a think about how you communicate and see if there is something you can do to help your own situation too."
YES you are right! I'm not saying that I'm socially terrible, although here i am talking to people i don't know on the internet (but then so are you) but you're right because isn't communication the fabric of life. I mean, aren't human relationships the most important thing in life and so everyone in the world should make communication the most important thing to them! Yes, we should all learn more about how to talk better, and all take a step back from our lives and look at how we communicate with people and see what we could do better. And that's exactly what my next move is going to be. I realise that that's not exactly what you meant when you just typed that phrase but thinking on it has made me realise how absolutely ridiculous it is that i spend so much time thinking and practicing my guitar technique, but no-one really sits down and evalutes their social technique even though it's much more important.

So what to do? Well, I could sit down and do the Freud thing, go through my childhood and look at the lessons I learned about communication then and how that's affecting me now. But it seem like the best course of action is to just have a think about how i approach all forms of communication from talkin to people, to body language to meeting new people, phone, email, letters, everything and think about how to be more open. How would i like people to approach me.

Comments on the topic?

UKRuss
08-23-2005, 11:32 AM
well....this is a music forum but I like the cut of your gib so:

I think you hit the nail on the head in your last paragraph,

"But it seem like the best course of action is to just have a think about how i approach all forms of communication from talkin to people, to body language to meeting new people, phone, email, letters, everything and think about how to be more open. How would i like people to approach me."

Spot on.

Her's another thought though too which ties in with the above; If I was a member of the Orange Sock Club would I want someone trying to talk to me about art and feelings when I really want to talk about Orange Socks?

It's a two way process which you've identified. Try seeing things from their point of view too. It is difficult when your social pool is limited to those who surround you at a place of learning. The larger the pool the more likely you are to find the people with whom you click.

You sound like a very bright person to me and I think one of the things you will appreciate is that other people on a similar intellectual level are hard to come by. Being a social chameleon and communicating at a level which people can relate to based on your assessment of their own intellectual ability is a huge skill to have in your armoury.

You don't have to dumb down or be patronising but clearly there is a limit to peoples ability to understand the concepts you might be putting forward. Similarly, the level to which they wish to open their emotions to you will be governed by factors beyond your control.

I suppose what I'm saying is: It is not necessary for everyone to understand you in order for you to find peace with who you are. Try not to seek that understanding everywhere you go and with everyone you meet. Similarly, go to places and join societies and clubs that are more likely to provide those things for you (you came to IBM for example and we are all intellectual giants see?) so that when you do interact with people that don't, you will simply engage with them on a level that you will both find enjoyable. And you will find it easy to do.

Write letters where appropriate of course, ME would seem like a good case for that, but don't bombard those that don't want to open up, they have their reasons and their right to privacy.

Don't waste your time with people who will waste your time. Life is too short.

Finally, never give up practicing your guitar technique! (That was just so there is a music vein to this thread)

:D

Dushan S
09-01-2005, 12:09 AM
Red Sock, I will do my best to tell you few things I think you might find useful. English is not my first language, but I will do my best.

First, don't get me wrong, you are asking on a wrong forum. Not that people here are not fine, talented, deep people. But this is forum about music. And, I don't know if you are aware of that, you question actually is about spiritual matters. And it seems that part of your problem is that you are focused to find understanding and communication with fellow musicians.

There is clear difference: What you are explaining and talking about is yourself, your personality, soul, whatever. Music, and musicianship is something different, it is way of expression. Guitar is a just tool, or a ball, and you are playing game in a field of life. It can be a beautiful, emotionally connective, shiny tool but it is just a tool for self-expression.

What should artist, musician do to communicate an express himself? Artist is not talking, he is playing and composing, his music is way to share his emotions and ideas. So why you are not using what is natural way? Actually I have rarely found really deep friendship and understanding with other musicians on intellectual level, in usual communication, but music was something that we were sharing, and when we would playing our differences would disappear and there it was,- unity you are searching for and talking about.

So this is natural way for a musician, and this is what you have chosen to do. It is jour job, same as other jobs and ways of self-expression

If intellectual communication is what you really want, and in your post, this is what you are actually trying to accomplish, you should look for that in people interested in same things as you are interested, and this is not music, but communication, psychology, spirituality. And you should learn about yourself and be able to understand yourself better because, (don't get me wrong) if it is really hard for other people to get what you think, than maybe they are not a real problem, but - YOU.

Learn to communicate, learn to explain yourself better, It is not odd thing, a lot of people are not able to communicate themselves successfully, and things gets worse because a lot of people do not understand themselves deeply and have little knowledge, being satisfied to live on the surface of the iceberg called Self.
Also, maybe fact that you are unable to comprehend psychological processes happening inside of you is confusing you additionally. Very deep people appear as simple and easy to get along, as you may already noticed.

In your case, take your problem as a blessing as it can make you learn more, grow spiritually and intellectually and become more aware of yourself and world around you.

Madaxeman
09-04-2005, 06:41 AM
First, I agree about rap. I don't like to listen to it personally. But I think it is important to know its origins before criticizing it. I think it is not so much about music (ie: notes, theory, melody) as it is a form of self expression. It began in a segment of society that has historically been repressed. Music has been used throughout history to express human emotion and feeling. It is something that cannot be taken away. They can take your guitar, but not your song.
The downside is that any form of free expression in modern society has to be packaged, marketed, and copied so someone can make lots of money. What happens is the true intent is lost, and a hundred people spring up singing about the hood and killing cops. The legitimacy and relevance becomes diluted to the point that none of it seems real.
The second point about spiritualism not belonging in a music forum. I am not religious, but I believe there is something that gives us our spirit, soul, or whatever you wish to call it. It comes out in the form of intelligence, free expression, creativity, and MUSIC. Whether or not it comes from God or not is up to each individual person, but we wouldn't have music without it. The most expressive music program still does not capture the spirit of Steve Vai (or whoever) even if it programmed to play Vai note for note.
The third point about the immaturity and closed-minded attitudes that exist is it is everywhere in society. Sometimes having an open mind about other people is essential. People tend to put on masks to feel comfortable in a group setting. Getting to know someone better and seeing the true person inside might cut through the immaturity. Having the strength of character to be yourself is difficult in a society that simultaneously condemns and praises individuality. Be yourself and be open to others. I have yet to find another person who would fit the mold of me. And wouldn't life be boring if everyone did?
Thanks to everyone for the mental stimulation-it's better than coffee!

Apple-Joe
11-12-2005, 08:47 PM
Mad artist. Mad artist. Mad artist. Is this working now? Only testing. I haven't been able to submit posts the last minutes. What's going on? Only testing.