Gary Moore / Uli John Roth

[Apple-Joe]

I've listened to Gary Moore for a while, yet I'm no expert.

Yesterday I watched a Uli John Roth clip for the first time. I've listened to a few solos by him before, but never explored him.

After watching a few clips of Roth, it struck me immediately that his sound was somewhat similar to Gary Moore's - but Roth's technical proficiency seemed to be a little better.

Any thoughts?

[gersdal]

Gary Moore and Uli John Roth were two of my favourite guitarists at more or less the same time (around Thin Lizzy's Black Rose album). I guess they are both quite melodic in their playing, but I would now rate Uli John Roth a lot higher than Gary Moore as a guitarist. Uli has an eminent technique, where Gary is rather sloppy in a rock'n'roll kind a way :rolleyes: . Uli is playing over complicated chord progressions, while Gary is usually preferring simple diatonic or blues progression. Hence... Don't know... I guess I do not see the same similarities as you :p

[smallbusrider]

I really don't see the similarity between the two. Can't really say any guitar player is better than the other. Uli's strengths: knowledge of scales, good technique (very smooth) and very melodic. Gary's strengths: IMHO much more entertaining to listen to. Yes he is pretty sloppy when he tries playing some scalar patterns, but I do not find him sloppy at all in other areas. Good hammer on technique,great tone,great phrasing, very little FX-Instantly recognizable.(I think he invented using the flat 5 instead of the fourth in the oft used pentatonic repeating lick (In Em pentatonic: pick Bb on G string followed by hammering from B to D pulling off from D to D)) Pick up something from his "metal" (if you want to call it that) years. Corridors of Power is one of the best guitar albums in the world. Just a stock Strat and a cranked Marshall...ROCK AND ROLL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Apple-Joe]

I see. I have not listened enough to Roth, but somehow I instantly thought of a Gary Moore with more technique when watching the Roth clip.

They both have probably a great sense of melody.

[smallbusrider]

I see. I have not listened enough to Roth, but somehow I instantly thought of a Gary Moore with more technique when watching the Roth clip.

They both have probably a great sense of melody.
Maybe Yngwie is Clapton with more technique!!! LOL!!!!!!! :)

[Len H]

I really hadn't thought of Gary More and Uli Roth as being very similar, although I think they are both excellent. Roth was influenced by Hendrix earlier in his career with The Scorpions (he still plays Hendrix tunes in concert), but developed into much more than a Jimi clone. His solo in "Sails of Charon" is a masterpiece, one of the earliest examples (1977) of the Phrygian Dominant/ Harmonic Minor sound in rock music. He continued to expand his musical horizons after leaving the Scorps, fronting his band Electric Sun, and then moving away from rock and toward classical. He plays a special guitar that he developed with 31(?) frets and the ability to play in the same register as a violin. His latest release is "Metamorphosis", where he arranges Vivaldi's Four Seasons to be played with a small orchestra with his guitar playing the lead violin lines. He also plays a stunning rendition of Beethoven's 9th Symphony live where he arpeggiates the melody.

On the other hand Gary Moore is someone I am not as familiar with, although I have his "We Want Moore" and "Still Got the Blues" albums. He is very firey on "We Want Moore", with a blistering solo in "Shapes of Things", as well as many other standout moments. I wouldn't call Moore sloppy as much as raw; he really never falls apart technique-wise, it is just not as polished as Roth's. He is like a big-block Corvette as opposed to a Ferarri to use a car analogy. Moore possesses a great sense of melody, examples include "Parisienne Walkways" and "Still Got the Blues". Sustain, vibrato, bends to pitch, really good stuff.

To sum up a long-winded post, I would say that Roth is more polished and has a larger musical vocabulary. He incorporates advanced techniques such as sweep picking in his playing. Gary Moore has a raw energy to his playing that is also very appealing, and he can also rip up the fretboard pretty good. He has apparently lost the fire he had in his younger days, and is now more interested in playing blues.

[Apple-Joe]

Maybe Yngwie is Clapton with more technique!!! LOL!!!!!!! :)

You were probably 80 % joking, but;

I recognized a certain feel in Uli John Roth's playing. A feel quite similar to Gary Moore's.

Yngwie Malmsteen has a technique superior to Clapton's technique - no doubt about that - but I am afraid Clapton has something 'else' which Malmsteen simply lacks. He is better technically, he has feel too, etc. etc., but no matter how you look at it, Clapton's got an own characteristic atmosphere which Malmsteen can't re-create. Hence, it is not quite the same thing.

[gersdal]

Yngwie Malmsteen has a technique superior to Clapton's technique - no doubt about that - but I am afraid Clapton has something 'else' which Malmsteen simply lacks. He is better technically, he has feel too, etc. etc., but no matter how you look at it, Clapton's got an own characteristic atmosphere which Malmsteen can't re-create. Hence, it is not quite the same thing. I agree with you analysis, but here we are on a thin line of personal experiences and comprehension of their playing. Since we are at IBM, we should look for similarities and differences in terms of playing technique and analyse the music based on music theory to find similarities and differences. The personal preferences has to go to other forums.
On Clapton vs Malmsteen it is a comparisment of a blues player in rock and a self acclaimed classical music inspired player in rock. To me the difference is there. I would never compare them in any way, the basis is just to different.

[Apple-Joe]

I agree with you analysis, but here we are on a thin line of personal experiences and comprehension of their playing. Since we are at IBM, we should look for similarities and differences in terms of playing technique and analyse the music based on music theory to find similarities and differences. The personal preferences has to go to other forums.
On Clapton vs Malmsteen it is a comparisment of a blues player in rock and a self acclaimed classical music inspired player in rock. To me the difference is there. I would never compare them in any way, the basis is just to different.

OK. I just wanted to make a reply to the joke - which probably contained certain amounts of verity/sincerity 'behind' the joke itself.

[smallbusrider]

Just wanted to chime in...I was 100% joking!!! :)
I definitely was not trying to compare Clapton to Yngwie. I was just bustin' some ballz! By the way, Uli has an awsome web site...
www.ulijonroth.com

Some awesome Video clips with his band, UFO and Michael Schenker, and Jack Bruce...Dig how clean his "distorted" sound is... Enjoy! :)

[gersdal]

By the way, Uli has an awsome web site...
www.ulijonroth.com
Some awesome Video clips with his band, UFO and Michael Schenker, and Jack Bruce...Dig how clean his "distorted" sound is... Enjoy! :)
Thanks for the link... the videos was just awesome. Uli has been doing this kind a stuff since mid 70ties. He still rocks :D

[Len H]

Uli is really amazing; I have loved his playing since I heard him on the "Virgin Killer" album with the Scorpions in the late 70s. It was the first time I remember a guitarist doing the now popular descending 16th note run on one string in the "Catch Your Train" solo. He is one of those few who can express himself equally well with a simple bend or vibrato, as well as by virtuosity shredding. I was lucky enough to catch him on tour in 2004 with Michael Schenker, and both were excellent. Since it was in a rather small venue I was able to get up close to see Uli in action. A few observations: his "Sky Guitar" is a work of art, and he gets it to speak in many voices. He can get the singing violin-tone, especially in the upper registers (30+ frets) as well as a very good Hendrix tone which he used to great effect in "All Along the Watchtower". His fretting hand is relaxed and moves fluidly, this helps in sweeping and string-skipping on a 7 string guitar, especially with a scalloped fingerboard. His bends and vibrato are first class. He uses all four fingers on his fretting hand, the pinky is definately a major participant. His picking technique is alternate/economy, and he doesn't truly anchor; his picking hand floats over the strings. It looked as though he holds the pick (the pick looked to be pretty large) toward the tip of his thumb and index finger, and had a little more bend in the thumb knuckle than most guitarists, almost as if he was making the OK sign. As mentioned in other posts, check out his website www.ulijonroth.com and take a look at a couple of his videos, a picture is worth 1000 words, and an Uli Roth video is worth more than that.

[Schooligo]

Hi,

thanks for the thorough explanation of your observations about Uli John Roth, Len H.

just a quick question, could you explain how to do this:
"the first time I remember a guitarist doing the now popular descending 16th note run on one string"

In my experience that description could mean many things, could you get more specific,

maybe create a powertab so that we can understand what you are referring to?

Thanks.

[Len H]

Sorry about that explanation of the descending single string sixteenth note run. Using the key of A minor as an example, it would be A-G-F-E-G-F-E-D-F-E-D-C-E-D-C-B-D-C-B-A etc, or in tab form, first string; 17-15-13-12-15-13-12-10-13-12-10-8-12-10-8-7-10-8-7-5 etc. Uli has said that this run evoked an image of a train steaming away... This is now a very popular neoclassical riff, along with the ascending version going up the neck.

[Schooligo]

so what your referring to Len H is it's a descending(like in your example) &/or ascending 4 note sequence of 16th notes, sometimes starting on the root, respecting the notes of a particular scale like A minor.

Thanks Len H for writing back and providing your explanation!! :D

[Apple-Joe]

You are talking about the videos which I watched. It was the first time I watched him, and I have not heard many songs by him either. I was impressed. My favourite was the first clip on the page. I have deleted the files now due to their size.

Anyway, I am now aware that he is another great guitarist who is worth exploring further. Really a well-rounded (isn't that the right word? -> versatile/proficient) guitarist.

[Tailgunner]

Im just gonna say this and leave it they both rule and they can both show us a thing or two on guitar