Composition Theory

[StupendousMan]

Hi,

I'm posting this here because everywhere else seems to be guitarists.
I've done my grade 5 theory a couple of years back but i haven't really progressed any further. I was wondering if anyone could suggest any books etc. that would increase my theory knowledge in aid of composing piano music. I've looked for books but they all seem quite heavy reading.

Thanks

Peace out

[LaughingSkull]

And you thought guitarist won't find you here?
(sorry, couln't resist that).
Anyway, I would say that books about music theory does not focus on instrument. They might be heavy reading, but that's it ... just start.

[StupendousMan]

Haha. It seems like i'm the only non-guitarist here.

I was just wondering if there was anything that focused more on theory in aid of composing. Something a bit more concise.

I don't know. Maybe i'm just hoping in vain.

[Spino]

With respect man, if you've got as far as Grade 5 you've got a fair way to go yet before you have the tools for composition. I've got a brother who's a accomplished drummer and he's just done his Grade 4 Piano and he says he's in no way ready for it. But then who's to stop you and I'm sure there are plenty of books available on this topic ,like the Jamey Abersold series or Berklee Press so hack away and G'luck .

[reventlov]

First get yourself up to Grade 8 theory. Then study four part harmony, counterpoint, form and instrumentation; analyse thoroughly some compositions by composers you admire; listen analytically to a wide range of different kinds of music.

That will give you the tools you need, at which point it's all down to whether or not you have the natural talents for it.

You specifically mentioned that you wanted to compose piano music - it's worth noticing that most great composers of piano music were also great pianists, so you should also be working hard on your keyboard technique - the more 'in depth' your knowledge of the piano the better. I'ts also worth noticing that such composers rarely confined themselves to writing only for the piano - think of Mozart, Schumann, Chopin, Debussy, Britten and right up to present day pianist/composers like Chick Corea - all great pianists as well as composers, and all men who have written for other instruments.

When you say that the books on this kind of thing are 'heavy reading', you're unfortunately correct, this stuff isn't easy to master, you just have to get your head down and get on with it, there's no easy way.

There are lots of books to choose from - some of the standard books worth checking out are those by Walter Piston and by William Lovelock. Piston's books are huge and as comprehensive as can be imagined - most of what you need to know appears somewhere in his work if you have the patience to work through it all methodically. Lovelock's books are fairly concise considering the complexity of the subject, but they are very dry and a little 'rule-bound' - they're worth studying though, especially his three books on harmony (entitled 1st, 2nd and 3rd Year Harmony respectively) and his book 'Form in Brief', which is a great little introduction to form. It's also worth checking out books by Paul Steinitz, whose approach to teaching composition involves lots of quoting of examples from the work of established composers, and is consequently less dry.

Good luck.

[StupendousMan]

Thanks a lot. That's all really useful. I know i'm still early on. I just would like to get a head start.

[dragonsofeden]

music theory grades? strange ive never heard of them, i did a search on google, and it seems like there are exams you can take? can anyone point me towards more information on the subject?

[StupendousMan]

As far as i'm aware they go up to grade 6. You have to pass Grade 5 theory to be able to do anything after grade 5 practical on an instrument. They're just like practical exams in that they do them every term and you have to be entered for it but its just like a big exam sat in a hall.

[reventlov]

The main exam board which offers theory exams is the Associated Board of the Royal Schools of Music. Theory grades go from 1 to 8. Their syllabus can be seen on http://www.abrsm.org/resources/theor...Complete08.pdf

The board is based in London and examines people in many countries, they have an excellent reputation whose grades are recognised by many official education bodies in various parts of the world.

If you get up to grade 8 standard, you're ready to begin the serious study of composition.

[dragonsofeden]

cool, i am going to get myself up to grade 8. can anyone give me an example of the examination process? how does it work? do you have to fly to london to take the tests? do you have to take them sequentially or can you just take number 8 and be done with it?

[reventlov]

You can sit them in many places over the UK - check the ABRSM site for your local information, it's not necessary to go to London. You don't have to take them sequentially, you can go straight in at grade 8 when you feel you're ready for it. The exams are held three times a year - all the info you need really is on their site which is at http://www.abrsm.org

[faintron]

I haven't heard of the grades yet either. It's interesting, but what is the point of getting an exam or up to a specific "grade" level? Does this have any benefit to those of us who compose pop music? In other words, respectfully, why would a musician mess with any of this?

[priji]

Kent Holliday studied composition with Paul Fetler and Dominick Argento at the University of Minnesota, where he received his Ph.D. in music theory-composition in 1968. He subsequently did postgraduate work in Paris, France, and at Dartmouth College and the University of New Hampshire. In 1969 he worked with Pietro Grossi on computer music in the Studio di Fonologia S2FM in Florence, Italy, and in 1988 studied composition on research-leave with Witold Szalonek of the Hochschule der Kunst in Berlin, Germany. His sonata for tuba can be heard here. Dr. Holliday was the winner of the Virginia Music Teachers Association Composition Competition in 1983, 1996, and 1999. His Four Evocations won first place in the New Music Delaware Composition Competition in 1996. He taught music composition, theory, history, piano, and selected courses in the humanities at Virginia Tech since 1974. His book, Reproducing Pianos Past and Present, was published by Mellen Press in1989.

[StupendousMan]

Originally Posted by faintron

I haven't heard of the grades yet either. It's interesting, but what is the point of getting an exam or up to a specific "grade" level? Does this have any benefit to those of us who compose pop music? In other words, respectfully, why would a musician mess with any of this?

In respect to instuments, it's necessary to pass grade 5 theory in order to progress above grade 5 practical.
From a composers point of view it is really useful in understanding how music works. I don't know what else to say really.

[graypianoflying]

Originally Posted by faintron

I haven't heard of the grades yet either. It's interesting, but what is the point of getting an exam or up to a specific "grade" level? Does this have any benefit to those of us who compose pop music? In other words, respectfully, why would a musician mess with any of this?

I don't know about these grades specifically, but in Canada we have the Royal Conservatory of Music, which I imagine is similar. What I think is good about the exams is that they give you something to work towards, and therefore help you make sure you're progressing. Also, they help you choose what to work on so you work on pieces that are at your level or a little above it, and not way above it.

Additionally, when you apply to university it gives you a benchmark, so you can pretty much tell what your chances are of getting in. Most university music programs in Canada require grade 8 practical for their general music programs (theory, composition, history, musicology, music education, etc.) and grade 10 for the performance programs. So, you know that if you've only got, say, grade 6 you don't have a chance, whereas if you've got grade 9 you're pretty much assured of getting in.