iii function as I chord-Phrygian progressions...

curiousgeorge · 09-22-2004, 02:32 AM

Hey,

I was wanting to write an instrumental with a crazy, super long Phrygian solo. Are there any standard phrygian progressions or iii functioning as I (are they the same thing?) progressions, or what is the logic behind creating chord progressions with other scale degrees functioning as the I?

*Zatz* · 09-22-2004, 10:06 AM

Hi curiousgeorge!

Have a look into this thread:
http://www.ibreathemusic.com/forums/...ead.php?t=3261

Though Lydian mode was in the focus there you may still apply about the same approach to building Phrygian progressions.

Flamenco progression Am->G->F->E can also be used for what you're going for if you really want to come up with a long solo. See this thread:
http://www.ibreathemusic.com/forums/...ead.php?t=4044

Regards,
Zatz.

Malcolm · 09-22-2004, 12:44 PM

Using the who wants to go to whom on the link shown above. For that long progression.....

Let your chord progression loop on itself not returning to tonic, i.e. when you get back to V instead of going to I take it to VII (I think we are in minor, right) and work your way back using III and VI then to iv and start the loop over again with VII.

debaser · 09-22-2004, 02:20 PM

One thing to bear in mind about any mode or exotic scale is that you can use them in situations that don't directly dictate that they not be used. That is to say, if you have a progression which is moving from Amin to F, there is no obvious reason why you couldn't use a phrygian against it, although natural minor would probably be the more common choice. If you treat the b9 as a passing tone, you'll be fine. Also, because phrygian lacks concrete resolutions(there is a minor chord where the V should be), any chord progressions that you come up with to fit it will tend to be modal, as opposed to tonal. Just make sure you get the b9 in there somewhere.

curiousgeorge · 09-22-2004, 06:11 PM

Ok, but what is the difference between modal and tonal? D' you mean tonal as relying on chord tones? How does the b9 play into this? Just one more question, I swear! Could somebody list the inherent properties of the modes(ie, "...phrygian does not have concrete resolutions..."-Debaser), given that I know Lydian has a dreamy sound and a #4, Aeolian is minor and sad and has a b3,b6,b7 etc etc...
Thanks!

debaser · 09-22-2004, 07:50 PM

For a great explanation of tonal vs. modal see this thread: http://www.ibreathemusic.com/forums/...ead.php?t=5913

As far as the b9, well that's one the most defining characteristics of the phrygian sound. Anytime you move from a minor chord to a major chord a 1/2 step away and back it will sound phrygian.

I also would add that a lack of strong resolutions(to the tonic) is characteristic of modes in general, not just phrygian, because they lack a V7(see Maarten's definition of tonal vs. modal- what a helpful guy) to voice-lead back to the I. I don't know if the mood that each mode tends to elicit can really be described in a way that everyone could agree on. As far as the intervals that define them, I'm sure you can all do that for yourselves.

09-22-2004, 02:32 AM	#1
curiousgeorge fan of the G string Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Britney's basement Posts: 1,073	iii function as I chord-Phrygian progressions... Hey, I was wanting to write an instrumental with a crazy, super long Phrygian solo. Are there any standard phrygian progressions or iii functioning as I (are they the same thing?) progressions, or what is the logic behind creating chord progressions with other scale degrees functioning as the I?

09-22-2004, 10:06 AM	#2
Zatz Mode Rator Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Kiev, Ukraine Posts: 1,345	Hi curiousgeorge! Have a look into this thread: http://www.ibreathemusic.com/forums/...ead.php?t=3261 Though Lydian mode was in the focus there you may still apply about the same approach to building Phrygian progressions. Flamenco progression Am->G->F->E can also be used for what you're going for if you really want to come up with a long solo. See this thread: http://www.ibreathemusic.com/forums/...ead.php?t=4044 Regards, Zatz. __________________ Zadd9 -> A6 -> T#9b5 -> Zmaj7

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09-22-2004, 12:44 PM	#3
Malcolm Registered User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Deep East Texas Piney Woods Posts: 2,089	Using the who wants to go to whom on the link shown above. For that long progression..... Let your chord progression loop on itself not returning to tonic, i.e. when you get back to V instead of going to I take it to VII (I think we are in minor, right) and work your way back using III and VI then to iv and start the loop over again with VII.

09-22-2004, 02:20 PM	#4
debaser Registered User Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 455	One thing to bear in mind about any mode or exotic scale is that you can use them in situations that don't directly dictate that they not be used. That is to say, if you have a progression which is moving from Amin to F, there is no obvious reason why you couldn't use a phrygian against it, although natural minor would probably be the more common choice. If you treat the b9 as a passing tone, you'll be fine. Also, because phrygian lacks concrete resolutions(there is a minor chord where the V should be), any chord progressions that you come up with to fit it will tend to be modal, as opposed to tonal. Just make sure you get the b9 in there somewhere.

09-22-2004, 06:11 PM	#5
curiousgeorge fan of the G string Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Britney's basement Posts: 1,073	Ok, but what is the difference between modal and tonal? D' you mean tonal as relying on chord tones? How does the b9 play into this? Just one more question, I swear! Could somebody list the inherent properties of the modes(ie, "...phrygian does not have concrete resolutions..."-Debaser), given that I know Lydian has a dreamy sound and a #4, Aeolian is minor and sad and has a b3,b6,b7 etc etc... Thanks!

09-22-2004, 07:50 PM	#6
debaser Registered User Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 455	For a great explanation of tonal vs. modal see this thread: http://www.ibreathemusic.com/forums/...ead.php?t=5913 As far as the b9, well that's one the most defining characteristics of the phrygian sound. Anytime you move from a minor chord to a major chord a 1/2 step away and back it will sound phrygian. I also would add that a lack of strong resolutions(to the tonic) is characteristic of modes in general, not just phrygian, because they lack a V7(see Maarten's definition of tonal vs. modal- what a helpful guy) to voice-lead back to the I. I don't know if the mood that each mode tends to elicit can really be described in a way that everyone could agree on. As far as the intervals that define them, I'm sure you can all do that for yourselves.